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Post by Premier on Sept 14, 2017 19:20:56 GMT -5
I'm torn about Daca. Imagine being deported to a place you have never been. Without knowing anyone.
But at the same time, we can't keep encouraging the parents to come here illegally so their kids are set. It has to stop.
Maybe the solution is to legitimize the ones that are here and cancel it for future arrivals.
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Post by slaytan on Sept 14, 2017 19:36:42 GMT -5
I'm torn about Daca. Imagine being deported to a place you have never been. Without knowing anyone. But at the same time, we can't keep encouraging the parents to come here illegally so their kids are set. It has to stop. Maybe the solution is to legitimize the ones that are here and cancel it for future arrivals. We have tried that before, and the left simply breaks every single agreement they make from day 1 I, too, sympathize with the "dreamers." But I also sympathize with German babies who had to die, because America had to beat Hitler. And I say, in each case: sorry bout your luck. |
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Post by ocmmafan on Sept 14, 2017 21:45:00 GMT -5
I'm torn about Daca. Imagine being deported to a place you have never been. Without knowing anyone. But at the same time, we can't keep encouraging the parents to come here illegally so their kids are set. It has to stop. Maybe the solution is to legitimize the ones that are here and cancel it for future arrivals. Dude, I have had hundreds of conversations with agg felons we deport that don't have single relative or friend where they are going. And the mexican police are not nice to them when they arrive and will kick their ass and rob them. It's the harsh reality of being a fugitive living in the shadows that risks it to commit crime. And some will commit crimes in prison to extend their stay rather than face removal. I have seen gang bangers who think they are badass and grow up hard that I can tell are shitting their pants at the unknown that awaits them when we are loading them on a bus or plane to go back. I feel bad, but these are criminals and they know they are rolling the dice. The real crazy shit are the legal permanent residents (green card holders) who have had it for 20 years but never naturalize and become citizens. We light them up on possession for sale and they have a weapon, then its an agg felony and we rescind their green card and deport them. Some dont even realize they are not citizens. I don't think the dreamers are going anywhere. But I do think the current DACA program is going to be upended and the replacement will be something that protects the non criminal students that the majority don't want to remove. |
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Post by johncfc on Sept 14, 2017 22:00:02 GMT -5
I'm torn about Daca. Imagine being deported to a place you have never been. Without knowing anyone. But at the same time, we can't keep encouraging the parents to come here illegally so their kids are set. It has to stop. Maybe the solution is to legitimize the ones that are here and cancel it for future arrivals. We have tried that before, and the left simply breaks every single agreement they make from day 1 I, too, sympathize with the "dreamers." But I also sympathize with German babies who had to die, because America had to beat Hitler. And I say, in each case: sorry bout your luck. Nice one! Gave me a good laugh! |
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Post by Baph on Sept 14, 2017 22:22:35 GMT -5
It's just a fucked situation that's very likely unfuckable. What used to be a pretty balanced entry system with a lot of diversity (I thought we liked diversity?) is now almost entirely Mexican and Central American immigration. Once immigration changed from the merit based mosaic of immigrants from all over euorpe, asia, and every corner of the globe, now to the open borders policy, it's been a deluge from Mexico and it's gotten to the point that people just quit bothering immigrating at all and opt instead to just pour in by the thousands, fake a couple documents, claim to be Dreamers or find a bus to a sanctuary city, and it's ballgame. Deporting anything of significance would be political suicide. Deporting en mass would be tantamount to inciting a civil fucking war. It simply cannot be done in 2017. People who snuck in will get amnesty, no wall will be built, no taxes will be cut, no healthcare will be revised or repealed, no war will be stopped, no swamp will be drained, ever, by anyone, and deep down we all know it.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2017 7:29:50 GMT -5
Evidence Trump is pretty feckin smaht:
1. DREAMERS = pet cause of left.
2. DACA = Constitutionally illegal route taken to allow pet cause of left to progress.
3. The Wall = Trump's pet cause.
4. Trump undoes DACA, throws it to Congress.
5. Trump begins appearing publicly with Pelosi and Schumer.
6. Media starts pumping the importance of DACA and Dreamers, applying pressure to Congress to get DACA solved.
7. Trump goes into business negotitation mode them moment the media has turned their SJW eyes onto their own supporters.
8. You want the reconfigured action regarding DREAMERS to be signed when it hits my desk? Fund the wall.
That's political Judo on the black belt level.
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Post by Premier on Sept 15, 2017 7:53:38 GMT -5
I'm torn about Daca. Imagine being deported to a place you have never been. Without knowing anyone. But at the same time, we can't keep encouraging the parents to come here illegally so their kids are set. It has to stop. Maybe the solution is to legitimize the ones that are here and cancel it for future arrivals. Dude, I have had hundreds of conversations with agg felons we deport that don't have single relative or friend where they are going. And the mexican police are not nice to them when they arrive and will kick their ass and rob them. It's the harsh reality of being a fugitive living in the shadows that risks it to commit crime. And some will commit crimes in prison to extend their stay rather than face removal. I have seen gang bangers who think they are badass and grow up hard that I can tell are shitting their pants at the unknown that awaits them when we are loading them on a bus or plane to go back. I feel bad, but these are criminals and they know they are rolling the dice. The real crazy shit are the legal permanent residents (green card holders) who have had it for 20 years but never naturalize and become citizens. We light them up on possession for sale and they have a weapon, then its an agg felony and we rescind their green card and deport them. Some dont even realize they are not citizens. I don't think the dreamers are going anywhere. But I do think the current DACA program is going to be upended and the replacement will be something that protects the non criminal students that the majority don't want to remove. Criminals were the furthest thing from my mind when I made that comment. i guess I was just thinking about some random kid getting caught in a raid or something. But yeah, your comments opened up my eyes to another side of argument that I wasn't even thinking about. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2017 8:59:49 GMT -5
If parents lie about a kids birth date and get him on a little league team that he is 2 years too old to play on... and he consequently starts beating the shit out of everyone with 80 mph fastballs... the general consensus will always be that he got on the team by breaking the rules and should be removed.
It wasn't his fault, and all of the blame can be placed on his parents... however that doesn't make it okay for him to keep playing. If we are going to live in a country where people are expected to know and follow the rules otherwise they will have to face consequences like jail and fines, then you need to apply those same standards across the board.
If the "dreamers" (fucking liberals and their fluffy titles of bad things) are going to get a free pass and bypass the law... then as a natural born citizen I feel I should be able to pick 2 laws that I want to bypass and avoid consequences. I mean that is only logical and fair right?
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Post by Angelo on Sept 15, 2017 10:07:39 GMT -5
Stockley was acquitted today, fires have already broken out, city preparing to be locked down for riots.
The cop gets busted on camera trying to ram his car into the "suspect" even when the suspect was pulling over, proceeds to say "I'm going to kill this motherfucker", goes to the driver side window and shoots the guy 5 times. Then gets busted planting a gun. Even the police department wasn't backing him up.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2017 10:56:55 GMT -5
If parents lie about a kids birth date and get him on a little league team that he is 2 years too old to play on... and he consequently starts beating the shit out of everyone with 80 mph fastballs... the general consensus will always be that he got on the team by breaking the rules and should be removed. It wasn't his fault, and all of the blame can be placed on his parents... however that doesn't make it okay for him to keep playing. If we are going to live in a country where people are expected to know and follow the rules otherwise they will have to face consequences like jail and fines, then you need to apply those same standards across the board. If the "dreamers" (fucking liberals and their fluffy titles of bad things) are going to get a free pass and bypass the law... then as a natural born citizen I feel I should be able to pick 2 laws that I want to bypass and avoid consequences. I mean that is only logical and fair right? So where would a 25 year old go "back" to that has been here since they were...say...2 years old? Let's assume this person in particular has no criminal record and has been as productive member of society, served 4 years in the service and is now going to school. Where would we send this person to? |
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Post by Angelo on Sept 15, 2017 11:04:00 GMT -5
If parents lie about a kids birth date and get him on a little league team that he is 2 years too old to play on... and he consequently starts beating the shit out of everyone with 80 mph fastballs... the general consensus will always be that he got on the team by breaking the rules and should be removed. It wasn't his fault, and all of the blame can be placed on his parents... however that doesn't make it okay for him to keep playing. If we are going to live in a country where people are expected to know and follow the rules otherwise they will have to face consequences like jail and fines, then you need to apply those same standards across the board. If the "dreamers" (fucking liberals and their fluffy titles of bad things) are going to get a free pass and bypass the law... then as a natural born citizen I feel I should be able to pick 2 laws that I want to bypass and avoid consequences. I mean that is only logical and fair right? So where would a 25 year old go "back" to that has been here since they were...say...2 years old? Let's assume this person in particular has no criminal record and has been as productive member of society, served 4 years in the service and is now going to school. Where would we send this person to? I say keep them here in that case, but if we had to send them "back". I say place them in office in the country we send them back to. Even at 25 years old they are probably better suited to help fix up said country. |
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Post by daywork on Sept 15, 2017 11:06:52 GMT -5
If parents lie about a kids birth date and get him on a little league team that he is 2 years too old to play on... and he consequently starts beating the shit out of everyone with 80 mph fastballs... the general consensus will always be that he got on the team by breaking the rules and should be removed. It wasn't his fault, and all of the blame can be placed on his parents... however that doesn't make it okay for him to keep playing. If we are going to live in a country where people are expected to know and follow the rules otherwise they will have to face consequences like jail and fines, then you need to apply those same standards across the board. If the "dreamers" (fucking liberals and their fluffy titles of bad things) are going to get a free pass and bypass the law... then as a natural born citizen I feel I should be able to pick 2 laws that I want to bypass and avoid consequences. I mean that is only logical and fair right? So where would a 25 year old go "back" to that has been here since they were...say...2 years old? Let's assume this person in particular has no criminal record and has been as productive member of society, served 4 years in the service and is now going to school. Where would we send this person to? Quick question. How would a illegal get into the military?
Hell, I don't even know how they get into grade school. Don't they have to show a birth Certificate or green card when you 1st enroll them? How do they get drivers licenses?
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Post by Baph on Sept 15, 2017 11:30:18 GMT -5
Sounds like a pretty sweet deal to me -- you unload all your impoverished masses onto the US and 20 yrs later we send em back fully educated and bilingual. Is Mexico complaining about this deal?
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Post by Angelo on Sept 15, 2017 11:48:50 GMT -5
Local businesses and the school districts are sending everyone home, most planned events for the weekend are cancelled. One of the groups was just diverted off the highway but there are two now and a third forming further west. I do not see this ending peacefully, this city is gonna be shut down.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2017 11:52:49 GMT -5
If parents lie about a kids birth date and get him on a little league team that he is 2 years too old to play on... and he consequently starts beating the shit out of everyone with 80 mph fastballs... the general consensus will always be that he got on the team by breaking the rules and should be removed. It wasn't his fault, and all of the blame can be placed on his parents... however that doesn't make it okay for him to keep playing. If we are going to live in a country where people are expected to know and follow the rules otherwise they will have to face consequences like jail and fines, then you need to apply those same standards across the board. If the "dreamers" (fucking liberals and their fluffy titles of bad things) are going to get a free pass and bypass the law... then as a natural born citizen I feel I should be able to pick 2 laws that I want to bypass and avoid consequences. I mean that is only logical and fair right? So where would a 25 year old go "back" to that has been here since they were...say...2 years old? Let's assume this person in particular has no criminal record and has been as productive member of society, served 4 years in the service and is now going to school. Where would we send this person to? I don't know if I implied that they should all go back... but I don't necessarily think that. I do think some (maybe most) should be forced to go back to their country of origin, however I also do think that there should be a screening process where we keep the good ones who have a clean record. JosA: Came here at 2 years old. High school drop out, maybe a misdemeanor or worse, in and out of low skill jobs, on welfare for much of his life, on Medicaid for all of his life, little to no English competency, living in section 8 housing. JosB: Came here at 2 years old. High school graduate and maybe some secondary education. Clean criminal record. Fluent in English. Was on welfare and Medicaid but has since become independent and rents a house or apartment on the up-and-up. Making $40k a year working for a company where he is skilled and valued by the company as someone with potential and longevity. JosA - Deported immediately. Apply for a visa if you want to come back JosB - Pay a modest fine over the course of 5-10 years (I would say $20k over 10 years is fair). At the end of the 5-10 year window, if you still have a clean record and are financially not a blood sucking leech you get automatic citizenship minus voting rights. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2017 12:07:24 GMT -5
Local businesses and the school districts are sending everyone home, most planned events for the weekend are cancelled. One of the groups was just diverted off the highway but there are two now and a third forming further west. I do not see this ending peacefully, this city is gonna be shut down. Ya, lets fuck some innocent people personal property up because we are mad. I am guessing all of these looters read the trial notes and followed the evidence through from the beginning to end. Pretty funny that the blacks always seem to be able to get time off work to look during the week.... |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2017 12:13:04 GMT -5
I didn't mean to hint that you implied that, my question was not meant any deeper than the question itself. I look around LA and I think to myself, well, what realistically do you do in this situation?
I agree that a criminal record (dui included) should be a denial of citizenship. Hell, if you have a dui or bwi on your record, Canada won't let an American citizen in.
I feel if you have been here this entire time and have been holding down a job, you've got your shit together...let's get your papers in line and get this roadblock out of the way.
A citizen imo, should be able to vote though. Once you are a citizen I feel all rights should apply.
I'd like to see Trump go from Nazi white supremacist Russian lover to the savior of the Latinos. It would be an epic twist of media portrayal. I went to a 40th bday party last weekend. I was only white dude there. Old friends. Trump pinata. They hate that fucker. I'd love to see the tide change.
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Post by Angelo on Sept 15, 2017 12:18:08 GMT -5
Local businesses and the school districts are sending everyone home, most planned events for the weekend are cancelled. One of the groups was just diverted off the highway but there are two now and a third forming further west. I do not see this ending peacefully, this city is gonna be shut down. Ya, lets fuck some innocent people personal property up because we are mad. I am guessing all of these looters read the trial notes and followed the evidence through from the beginning to end. Pretty funny that the blacks always seem to be able to get time off work to look during the week.... They were following it closer than any other one around here because the DA's office and even the Police Department was keeping them updated because both were holding this up as a "look see we go after bad cops". Neither expected the judge to do this. It was the police department that pushed for charges in this case. Fellow officers testified against him! The police got the FBI involved back when it happened because (this was pre-ferguson) they weren't sure how to deal with this. I don't think they should be doing damage, but the people have been shouting forever that things need to be changed, and the people they elect while campaigning on that change isn't actually changing. Maybe there needs to be consequences that acts as the catalyst for actual change. It needs to be non-violent, we haven't come to a point to cross that line yet, but it doesn't need to have actual impact. At least this time they seem to be starting with city hall. |
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Post by Angelo on Sept 15, 2017 12:23:47 GMT -5
I'd like to see Trump go from Nazi white supremacist Russian lover to the savior of the Latinos. It would be an epic twist of media portrayal. It would make more sense than him not doing that though. He's been calling for amnesty and porous borders for a long time. His wall and border security didn't really pop up till he decided to run. Hell even when he decided to run, he changed slightly to boot out the criminals and then basically open the borders to everyone else. The closest he had to a position of secure borders, controlled immigration pre-campaign was support for tocuhback policy debate back in 07'. Though I could have recalled him commenting about how it was still too hard on the immigrants. |
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Post by Angelo on Sept 15, 2017 13:17:30 GMT -5
Just to clarify because I won't be surprised if this becomes a forum topic later on given how long this could potentially last.... Smith belonged in Prison. He was fleeing the cops, hit their cruiser when he fled, he had heroin on him and was observed delivering/selling some of it that sparked the cops going to stop him.
All the cops involved did their job right and well, except Stockley. Not only did he violate something like a dozen different departmental regulations (including drawing his personal AK-47 pistol at one point), but he claimed to have not been wearing his department issued gloves (that he was required to) when he moved the gun to the car seat, and that is how his DNA got on the weapon. However in the video, he had his gloves on! Also none of the police officers saw the gun on the seat (which was in plain sight) until AFTER Stockley went back to his vehicle and retrieved something from his personal bag and walked back to Smith's car.
Smith was a piece of shit and was gonna wind up in prison likely for the rest of his life. Stockley was just amped up and couldn't control his anger.
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Post by matt on Sept 15, 2017 13:35:56 GMT -5
We're in too deep now to send all the daca dreamers back...
It would be too long of a process...a "quagmire" if you will.
I will concede the daca dreamers but I want a bigger wall(with flesh melting razor wire) in return for my generous concession...
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Post by HumanAgent on Sept 15, 2017 15:07:01 GMT -5
Why is it xenophobic to want to have organized and rational immigration systems and to a the very least identify and assimilate those living here illegally who snuck in? Do we want to look more like Sweden or Germany or England? Do we want to be over-run? It's not hyperbole. Do we? I'm not sure we have a strong answer here. Many of us do not. If that is the standard for xenophobia, then it could be applied to nearly every country in the world. Tried sneaking into China, Saudi Arabia, Iceland, Russia, Scotland, Poland? Folks, you don't know what xenophobia is. You'll be in jail immediately and out of country in 24 hrs. But it's not a universal standard, it's not a consistent position, is it? It's only applied to the US. It's like Diane Feinstein grilling that judicial nominee over her Catholic faith, saying it could impact her rulings. Ok, sure, that's fair IF you will also grill Muslim nominees and question their faith and their motives, which would be utterly unimaginable and, frankly, outright political suicide. We ONLY attack western culture and ideas. Everyone else gets softballs and cheerleading. It's so tilted. It's so blatant at this point it's not even worth bothering to hide it or to pretend otherwise. Don't believe me? Take a pro Trump sign down to your local university and then post an update here an hour later. Take an anti-Islam sign. Take an anti illegal immigration sign. And, for the love of god, take a helmet and some protective eye wear. You're gonna need it. Godspeed, my friend. Better yet -- just post it on your social media today. I fucking DARE you. You know what the cost will be. You mock Christianity, you're a critic, edgy, artistic, exercising free speech. You mock Islam you're a disgusting racist bigot islamaphobe. You sneak into Mexico you're a criminal who is abusing a poor 3rd world country. You sneak into the US you're an angle with a dream that must be protected, championed, and fully funded. We are institutionally, systemically, culturally, philosophically tilted to an alarming level with the clear mission to repress and destroy our own way of life, our history, identity, and prominence in the world, and to lift up that which will replace, destroy, and subvert us. It's literally gotten comical, the mania with which this juvenile FUCK WHITEY has consumed the progressive movement. It's occupy wall st. It's BLM. It's antifa. It's whatever. But what it is . . . is fuck whitey. This writhing, self-loathing white guilt. This reckless teenage rebellion against daddy. This steady drum beat of vitriol and sabotage toward western culture and anglo identity is why people like Trump come out of nowhere like a satirical SNL skit and inexplicably skyrocket to the presidency without even the support of their own party. It's why people like Garth post the way they do and people don't say much. Deep down, maybe even subconsciously, you know we need people who will push back, even if they are 1/2 crazy, and you have to be 1/2 crazy to invite the kind of personal assault you're walking into. Seeing Ben Shapiro going back to Berkely this weekend . . . the man has almost indescribable courage. I mean, again, WTF do you think that bizarre Trump takeover was about, guys? There an instinctual desire to push back, to draw a line, to cling to the one guy crazy enough to be the asshole, say it out loud, and not get guilt tripped and shamed and silenced by PC culture and anti western ethos, even if there are some rough, sometimes really rough, edges. Sure, there's generalization that is inaccurate and over the top, but the context for that is an all out war on western culture and ideals that is flat out rabid, and it's rampant in media, politics, academia, and this goofy celebrity culture we've come to worship. We're in the emergency room with three bullet wounds and you're asking me to focus on a toothache. You're asking me stifle and oppose one of the few entities with the awareness and appropriate testosterone levels to push back. How does a teenage girl piss off dadday, when daddy is Uncle Sam? You embrace everything he opposes and rub it in his face. Islam, illegal immigration, black power, socialism, transgender weirdos in the girls bathroom . . . how do I torment my dad? Welp, apparently by burning the fucking house down. Great job. Just referring to the first couple sentences... Go try sneaking into mexico without bribing and see how much empathy and love you are met with lol. Shot on fucking sight if I'm not mistaken. Actually, sneaking into Mexico is extremely easy. You don't have to show any identification, at least within the border. The further you go south the more difficult it is. Try getting a job? Or even driving? Yet Mexicans or other Latin Americam and Central American pretty much expect both the minute they arrive. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2017 15:37:34 GMT -5
Just referring to the first couple sentences... Go try sneaking into mexico without bribing and see how much empathy and love you are met with lol. Shot on fucking sight if I'm not mistaken. Actually, sneaking into Mexico is extremely easy. You don't have to show any identification, at least within the border. The further you go south the more difficult it is. Try getting a job? Or even driving? Yet Mexicans or other Latin Americam and Central American pretty much expect both the minute they arrive. I should have been more specific. I meant going north into Mexico through thier southern border. |
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Post by Angelo on Sept 15, 2017 16:14:02 GMT -5
Well looks like cooler heads are prevailing. One of the groups dispersed, the other two have remained non-violent (except one person who was arrested and the crowd turned against him). A bus full of protesters arrived about 90 minutes ago though and seemingly haven't joined up with the two main protesting groups. People are starting to get off work and heading down though, lets hope it stays as it is for now.
I saw something interesting today though, that when a member of a government agency is brought up on charges, they should not be allowed a bench trial. I have to say, I agree with that, another balance to the system.
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Post by Angelo on Sept 15, 2017 17:19:42 GMT -5
Well they just arrested a guy trying to make sure an old woman that the police riot shielded to the ground was okay and proceeded to arrest her.
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Post by HumanAgent on Sept 15, 2017 17:50:30 GMT -5
On the scene reporting Angelo?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2017 17:54:05 GMT -5
So where would a 25 year old go "back" to that has been here since they were...say...2 years old? Let's assume this person in particular has no criminal record and has been as productive member of society, served 4 years in the service and is now going to school. Where would we send this person to? Quick question. How would a illegal get into the military?
Hell, I don't even know how they get into grade school. Don't they have to show a birth Certificate or green card when you 1st enroll them? How do they get drivers licenses?
I don't know how, but I know there are some that are serving. I don't really know too much about the process. |
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Post by Angelo on Sept 15, 2017 18:07:55 GMT -5
On the scene reporting Angelo? A buddy of mine just moved to Tower Grove South but he works in the area where the shit is going down so was sent home from work. That's when he saw the bus of protesters unloading. As for the "reporting" just watching the live newscasts, we have 4 local live views, not to mention all the people live streaming on their phones. I shouldn't like this kinda shit, but it better than normal TV and Movies because you don't know what's gonna actually happen. |
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Post by daywork on Sept 15, 2017 18:13:03 GMT -5
Quick question. How would a illegal get into the military?
Hell, I don't even know how they get into grade school. Don't they have to show a birth Certificate or green card when you 1st enroll them? How do they get drivers licenses?
I don't know how, but I know there are some that are serving. I don't really know too much about the process. That's some of the stuff I don't get. I know you can use a fake SSI number. But I entered a SSI number wrong for one of my employees. I got a call from the ADP questioning the number. They told me it was for a woman. So I would think going into the military or getting a regular job, you would get caught using a fake SSI number.
As far as the topic at hand.
I'm kind of torn on it. On one hand, you are illegal so you should be deported, even though you had no hand in it. On the other hand, if you were able to go through the school system. We let it happen for all those years, you should be able to stay. But not your parents.
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Post by Angelo on Sept 15, 2017 18:23:25 GMT -5
Quick question. How would a illegal get into the military?
Hell, I don't even know how they get into grade school. Don't they have to show a birth Certificate or green card when you 1st enroll them? How do they get drivers licenses?
I don't know how, but I know there are some that are serving. I don't really know too much about the process. My brother falsified information in order to enlist that if the government checked records they would have seen. He's still in the the Air Force what 8 years later? They don't really give a shit, they want troops to send over there. |
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