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Post by Angelo on Jul 12, 2017 8:36:51 GMT -5
The problem with the UK incident IMO is that they were refusing to allow the parents to attempt recognized current experimental treatments at no cost to the hospital or taxpayers. Experimental treatment that has nearly a non-existent chance of helping and would still not let him recover from his brain damage... They didn't confirm the extent of the brain damage, and nearly is the key word. The fact is there is a chance, may as well take it. Worst case scenario, they learn more about how to treat it. But NOOOO this is the new anti-science world we live in. |
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Post by CaveBearOG on Jul 12, 2017 9:09:38 GMT -5
Let the little guy die. I'm sorry for his parents but damn. But, come on??
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Post by Angelo on Jul 12, 2017 9:12:24 GMT -5
Let the little guy die. I'm sorry for his parents but damn. But, come on?? If he's gonna die, he's gonna die. He may as well help advance science regardless should he not? |
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Post by CaveBearOG on Jul 12, 2017 9:17:57 GMT -5
I'm very excited, I got my apartment yesterday. It's here in NY, in Bath, it's only 3 miles from the VA. I'll continue the outpatient program I've started here.i feel fantastic mentally, physically, emotionally, all that...im not slowing down this ride, but will proceed with caution. In my world confidence is great, overconfidence is a killer...walkin the line....
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Post by CaveBearOG on Jul 12, 2017 9:19:32 GMT -5
Let the little guy die. I'm sorry for his parents but damn. But, come on?? If he's gonna die, he's gonna die. He may as well help advance science regardless should he not? No, that could apply to damn near anyone with a terminal illness could it not??? |
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Post by Premier on Jul 12, 2017 9:24:28 GMT -5
Jim. For all this time I known you, I've never heard your voice. Until yesterday that I heard you speak on a FB video.
You my friend, sound like a country boy. LOL.
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Post by CaveBearOG on Jul 12, 2017 9:30:14 GMT -5
Jim. For all this time I known you, I've never heard your voice. Until yesterday that I heard you speak on a FB video. You my friend, sound like a country boy. LOL. Lol, I've always said I'm kracker to the core, now you know brother.. 😀 |
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Post by Angelo on Jul 12, 2017 9:40:10 GMT -5
I'm very excited, I got my apartment yesterday. It's here in NY, in Bath, it's only 3 miles from the VA. I'll continue the outpatient program I've started here.i feel fantastic mentally, physically, emotionally, all that...im not slowing down this ride, but will proceed with caution. In my world confidence is great, overconfidence is a killer...walkin the line.... That's where I used to stop if I needed gas when going between NY/PA. If he's gonna die, he's gonna die. He may as well help advance science regardless should he not? No, that could apply to damn near anyone with a terminal illness could it not??? It could, and should IMO in any case where the patient isn't in pain. If they can help contribute to figuring out the cause of the illness, and it doesn't negatively effect them, the parents should be allowed to do just that. |
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Post by matt on Jul 12, 2017 10:44:19 GMT -5
I'm very excited, I got my apartment yesterday. It's here in NY, in Bath, it's only 3 miles from the VA. I'll continue the outpatient program I've started here.i feel fantastic mentally, physically, emotionally, all that...im not slowing down this ride, but will proceed with caution. In my world confidence is great, overconfidence is a killer...walkin the line.... That's where I used to stop if I needed gas when going between NY/PA. No, that could apply to damn near anyone with a terminal illness could it not??? It could, and should IMO in any case where the patient isn't in pain. If they can help contribute to figuring out the cause of the illness, and it doesn't negatively effect them, the parents should be allowed to do just that. This is the crux of the issue... With government run, single payer, universal healthcare... The government decides which treatment is right for who. The government can then make a profit to loss analysis on individuals, and determine that they don't qualify for life saving care. Essentially, you have no hope for treatment because you have been "condemned" by the government. It takes the choice out of your hands. Your life, and the lives of your family members will now be decided by the government. |
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Post by matt on Jul 12, 2017 10:50:44 GMT -5
And with current trends, the US population will hit half a billion in 2100.
With numbers like that, you better believe the government will be making some executive decisions with your free healthcare.
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Post by Baph on Jul 12, 2017 10:52:03 GMT -5
The crux is the same crux we have in EVERY issue:
Are decisions made locally or centrally?
That's the ONLY real question in politics that matters.
Do I decide or is this call made by some bureaucrat in another time zone who . . . somehow . . . knows what's best for me, my money, my family, my hiring practices, my child rearing, etc?
That IS the only political dynamic there is. All else is window dressing.
Autonomy and localized control vs. reliance and centralized control.
P.S. remeber the smug fucking cunt progressive guffawing and mocking Palin's use of the word death panels? Who gets to decide if this little retard gets medical resources or if she's left to die and not worth it? A fucking death panel, you assholes. Everything you said would never happen and mocked conservatives for fearing is literally happening and your complete lack of shame or integrity allows you to ignore that and march bravely onward into marxist hell.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2017 11:32:24 GMT -5
That's where I used to stop if I needed gas when going between NY/PA. It could, and should IMO in any case where the patient isn't in pain. If they can help contribute to figuring out the cause of the illness, and it doesn't negatively effect them, the parents should be allowed to do just that. This is the crux of the issue... With government run, single payer, universal healthcare... The government decides which treatment is right for who. The government can then make a profit to loss analysis on individuals, and determine that they don't qualify for life saving care. Essentially, you have no hope for treatment because you have been "condemned" by the government. It takes the choice out of your hands. Your life, and the lives of your family members will now be decided by the government. This is a horse shit argument. The kid is brain damaged with little to no hope of helping his condition and even then, he is probably still severely brain damaged. The doctors, the actual medical experts are saying that the kid is doing nothing but suffering so they did not want to offer futile care. Key word is: futile. In order for this to occur, they needed the government to step in and make a decision. Just like in America with Terri Schiavo. We don't have Socialized medicine but ultimately the government had to make the decision. This isn't like the government is creating death panels and shit, it is a very unique case with unique circumstances and you are acting like it is the norm. It isn't.
This isn't a fucking "death panel" it isn't about resources. It is about an ethical issue of whether or not an 11 month old should suffer because of their parents decision to well, let him suffer. This shit happens all the time in ICUs across America. Some old grandma had a stroke and has a trach and lost capacity to make her own decisions. She begs for death but her "caring" kids won't allow it. Then eventually it goes to an ethics committee and if needed, the government will eventually weigh in.
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Post by Baph on Jul 12, 2017 11:34:45 GMT -5
Saw a deal last night claiming CNNs raitings are actually abysmal and, in fact, even worst than they appear as a significant portion is comprised of air ports, hotels, bars, gyms, restaurants, where traditionally (and now by sheer inertia) CNN has been the bland, center aisle news station you put on in public without favoring one side or the other. Actual people actually watching CNN . . . apparently pretty bad.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2017 13:02:03 GMT -5
Saw a deal last night claiming CNNs raitings are actually abysmal and, in fact, even worst than they appear as a significant portion is comprised of air ports, hotels, bars, gyms, restaurants, where traditionally (and no by sheer inertia) CNN has been the bland, center aisle news station you put on in public without favoring one side or the other. Actual people actually watching CNN . . . apparently pretty bad. More people watched Yogi Bear reruns on Nick At Night than CNN. Trend will continue, no doubt. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2017 13:12:17 GMT -5
The Delaware sized glacier broke free and is now floating.
Broke free a few days ago.
CNN just reported on it 14 minutes ago.
This is probably Russia's fault too....
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Post by Baph on Jul 12, 2017 13:22:37 GMT -5
Just read another deal on the "Trump Russia" leaks and revelations timeline . . . really interesting theories coming out. Things that people have known about for 9-10 months get strategically released far after the fact in order to fill the lulls in the news cycle, disrupt upcoming legislative pushes, or create distraction/chaos on the heels of international trips that might bring good press/momentum.
It's . . . ALMOST . . . like the deep state, Obama appointees, etc., have used the surveillance state to collect intell for the past two years and are allowing a trickle of psyops and propaganda to effectively filibuster Trump until mid-terms.
Remember when Trump said Obama tapped his phones and the whole world just laughed and laughed?
This latest Trump Jr meeting with Russian intel lady . . . some REALLY suspicious things about her visa approval already coming out. Who would have approved that after it was already denied? Who was in power 10 months ago, LET this happen, had the ability to tap these phones and view these emails, and then sit on it for a year and release it after the G20/Poland trip right before the final Healthcare push and congressional recess?
We may not even realize how fucking comically, tinfoil, Woody Heralson in a van living in Yellowstone, deep-fucking-state conspiracy world we're actually living in already, and it's got fuck-all to do with Dumpf being a dipshit on Twitter and trying to simplify the tax code.
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Post by Baph on Jul 12, 2017 14:07:29 GMT -5
Imagine if you will . . . if you fucking CAN . . . a "women's march" that unironically uses the hijab as a symbol of female empowerment.
Imagine a national political party that goes to war for gender-fluid bathroom protocols in grocery stores to the point the DOJ gets involved in suing a state that isn't wild about this.
Imagine a grass roots movement whose primary characteristic is vandalism and violence in the name of censorship.
Imagine the lunacy involved with actively trying to import hundreds of thousands of Muslims into American cities, un-vetted, and then calling anyone who wants to take a closer looks at this a xenophobic bigot.
I . . . I . . . it's just . . . fucking bizarre.
Garth is right -- they control EVERYTHING, yet lose because they're fucking terrifying, rabid, self-loathing, self-destructive, miserable nut jobs that people in middle-America simply recoil from, even when the alternative is . . . less than stellar.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2017 14:50:02 GMT -5
Experimental treatment that has nearly a non-existent chance of helping and would still not let him recover from his brain damage... They didn't confirm the extent of the brain damage, and nearly is the key word. The fact is there is a chance, may as well take it. Worst case scenario, they learn more about how to treat it. But NOOOO this is the new anti-science world we live in. You can't have a 17 day bout of seizures and not come away with some form of brain damage and you don't need a brain scan to know there is damage. The doctors have stated he won't open his eyes, interact, or even cry. He is encephalopathic. Do you have any idea how unethical it is to "take a chance?" The medical experts' opinion is that the kid is suffering so prolonging his life on a Hail Mary (that even the doctor's offering the treatment says there is slim to no chance of it actually working) is fucking asinine and cruel. You want to make the kid a guinea pig for "science" but have no idea of the ethical considerations because you are fucking stupid. Anti-science world we live in? God, you are a fucking toolbag. Maybe we should see how Syphilis affects blacks by not giving the appropriate antibiotics, in the name of science and all? Dipshit. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2017 14:51:20 GMT -5
Imagine if you will . . . if you fucking CAN . . . a "women's march" that unironically uses the hijab as a symbol of female empowerment. Imagine a national political party that goes to war for gender-fluid bathroom protocols in grocery stores to the point the DOJ gets involved in suing a state that isn't wild about this. Imagine a grass roots movement whose primary characteristic is vandalism and violence in the name of censorship. Imagine the lunacy involved with actively trying to import hundreds of thousands of Muslims into American cities, un-vetted, and then calling anyone who wants to take a closer looks at this a xenophobic bigot. I . . . I . . . it's just . . . fucking bizarre. Garth is right -- they control EVERYTHING, yet lose because they're fucking terrifying, rabid, self-loathing, self-destructive, miserable nut jobs that people in middle-America simply recoil from, even when the alternative is . . . less than stellar. These fuckers inundate my Facebook news feed. I can't believe this is real life anymore.... |
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Post by ToNoAvail on Jul 12, 2017 15:10:26 GMT -5
The left will win the war of attrition.
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Post by CaveBearOG on Jul 12, 2017 15:54:07 GMT -5
If in anyway you think performing experimental medicine on a patient who doesn't have the capacity to tell you they are in pain, you're a fuckin complete dumbass.
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Post by PatSox on Jul 12, 2017 17:09:00 GMT -5
The Delaware sized glacier broke free and is now floating. Broke free a few days ago. CNN just reported on it 14 minutes ago. This is probably Russia's fault too.... Or they reported it two days ago, but nobody noticed, because Yogi was stealing another 'picinic basket, right under Mr. Ranger's nose |
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Post by Angelo on Jul 12, 2017 17:21:09 GMT -5
The Delaware sized glacier broke free and is now floating. Broke free a few days ago. CNN just reported on it 14 minutes ago. This is probably Russia's fault too.... Or they reported it two days ago, but nobody noticed, because Yogi was stealing another 'picinic basket, right under Mr. Ranger's nose Reminds me of the news scenes in the 2nd episode of BoJack Horseman. MSNBSea cuts away from a historic major legislative event, to cover some BS ex-celebrity story, all the while the ticker at the bottom just spouting more BS news crap. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2017 17:24:56 GMT -5
Kid Rock running for Senate 2018.
And Dwayne The Rock Johnson is considering running for President in 2020.
In the classic film, Idiocracy, the president is also a former professional wrestler named Dwayne..Elizondo Mountain Dew Hector Camacho.
I need an island to head to so my reality can consist of waves and sand and the rest of this stuff can fade to distant memory.
This country is losing it's god damned mind.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2017 21:31:04 GMT -5
I wonder if Shia LeDouche is going to commit suicide Apparently no longer starring in those God-awful Transformer movies has pushed him over the edge....
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2017 21:36:01 GMT -5
Is anyone following tbe charlie gard story in the UK? Patsox, i'm looking at you. Socialized, single payer medicine is great!!! Everyone has healthcare! ...until the government decides its time for you to die. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't this poor kid have a rare, 100% fatal condition?
No chance whatsoever of getting cured?
He'd be just as doomed in any other country, regardless of its healthcare system. NOT a good argument against a single-payer one.
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Post by matt on Jul 12, 2017 21:52:29 GMT -5
Is anyone following tbe charlie gard story in the UK? Patsox, i'm looking at you. Socialized, single payer medicine is great!!! Everyone has healthcare! ...until the government decides its time for you to die. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't this poor kid have a rare, 100% fatal condition?
No chance whatsoever of getting cured?
He'd be just as doomed in any other country, regardless of its healthcare system. NOT a good argument against a single-payer one.
holy shit you're stupid...im putting you in the room marked C, for condemned. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2017 21:58:35 GMT -5
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't this poor kid have a rare, 100% fatal condition?
No chance whatsoever of getting cured?
He'd be just as doomed in any other country, regardless of its healthcare system. NOT a good argument against a single-payer one.
holy shit you're stupid...im putting you in the room marked C, for condemned. Then correct me, as I politely asked above, you testy prick.  |
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Post by Angelo on Jul 12, 2017 22:24:56 GMT -5
holy shit you're stupid...im putting you in the room marked C, for condemned. Then correct me, as I politely asked above, you testy prick. Multiple doctors have said there is a chance for the kid with various experimental treatments. The UK refuses to allow the parents to attempt said treatments even though it doesn't cost them or the taxpayer a dime. |
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Post by matt on Jul 12, 2017 22:44:12 GMT -5
holy shit you're stupid...im putting you in the room marked C, for condemned. Then correct me, as I politely asked above, you testy prick. Haha! Ok, jackel already gave the details but my bigger issue here is that the parents do have an avenue they'd like to explore but they've been told no, the baby must die. Over there in the UK, they appoint a 3rd party team to consult with the medical staff, consult with the family...and then the 3rd party determines the next course of medical action...so basically the decision now belongs to an outside party, rather than the patient. And so in this case the baby had been given a terminal prognosis and the 3rd party has decided to pull the plug while the family would like to explore other options. |
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