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Post by Baph on Mar 20, 2018 1:27:40 GMT -5
Hawking was famous because of his disability, pure and simple. Without that, he's a poor man's Leonard Suskind. Sure, we can point to some cool advances in theoretical physics, and in that field black hole research is probably the sexiest item on the menu, but still . . . he's no more or less influential or ground breaking that two dozen other theoretical physicists whose names we don't know . . . because they weren't handicapped. Being tragically, COMPLETELY handicapped and not falling into madness and begging for death every waking hour is a bit of an accomplishment on it's own. Still doing high level, scientifically relevant, theoretical math while living as a human potato . . . yeah, it's fucking impressive.
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Post by PatSox on Mar 20, 2018 8:53:22 GMT -5
Okay, I get it. While Hawking was a really smart guy, who lasted and functioned to an amazing degree, given his crushing disabilities, it's very hard to quantify just what his theories and formulas have tangibly done for mankind
But why the hostility here? Is it the atheist thing?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2018 8:59:14 GMT -5
I don't see any reason to be hostile, as the reality is that the guy was a fucking inspiration to a lot of people. Completely debilitated physically but still functioning higher mentally that just about every single troglodyte you'll see over the course of your day today. His theories have tangibly advanced three crucial areas of physics and took us one step closer to unifying the theories of gravity, cosmology and relativity. Pretty big deal that has little impact on today's humanity. But the shit this dude helped figure out will be very useful over the next 20-100 years. Also, without him there would probably be no:
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2018 10:31:10 GMT -5
Hawking was famous because of his disability, pure and simple. Without that, he's a poor man's Leonard Suskind. Sure, we can point to some cool advances in theoretical physics, and in that field black hole research is probably the sexiest item on the menu, but still . . . he's no more or less influential or ground breaking that two dozen other theoretical physicists whose names we don't know . . . because they weren't handicapped. Being tragically, COMPLETELY handicapped and not falling into madness and begging for death every waking hour is a bit of an accomplishment on it's own. Still doing high level, scientifically relevant, theoretical math while living as a human potato . . . yeah, it's fucking impressive. I agree with this. He has received 1,000x times the attention his peers have, many of which have done far more relevant and groundbreaking work... and the reason is because of his disability. Now I applaud him for pushing through and not using his diagnosis as a crutch to check out and do nothing with his life. I would argue that his passion for his work probably kept him alive and also hopefully provided inspiration for others with MS to not give up. However lets not pretend he was a once in a generation theorist who did anything to help the human race progress.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2018 14:41:56 GMT -5
Hawking was famous because of his disability, pure and simple. Without that, he's a poor man's Leonard Suskind. Sure, we can point to some cool advances in theoretical physics, and in that field black hole research is probably the sexiest item on the menu, but still . . . he's no more or less influential or ground breaking that two dozen other theoretical physicists whose names we don't know . . . because they weren't handicapped. Being tragically, COMPLETELY handicapped and not falling into madness and begging for death every waking hour is a bit of an accomplishment on it's own. Still doing high level, scientifically relevant, theoretical math while living as a human potato . . . yeah, it's fucking impressive. I agree with this. He has received 1,000x times the attention his peers have, many of which have done far more relevant and groundbreaking work... and the reason is because of his disability. Now I applaud him for pushing through and not using his diagnosis as a crutch to check out and do nothing with his life. I would argue that his passion for his work probably kept him alive and also hopefully provided inspiration for others with MS to not give up. However lets not pretend he was a once in a generation theorist who did anything to help the human race progress. The guy is credited with 9 specific theories that are integral to our understanding of black holes. Perhaps expanding our knowledge base of the universe beyond our world is not something you consider helpful to the human race, but...you're kinda simple if you don't grasp the importance of minds that figure these things out and yeah- he was very important because of the direction he specifically pushed thought within the scientific community. No idea what a "once in a generation theorist" would even be. Not a single one has existed alone at any time in history. And he had ALS, not MS.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2018 15:41:00 GMT -5
It is so hard to tell what the impact is and will be in the future. The technology NASA has used in the past based on testing theories has become vital to the medical community, such as x-ray machines and MRI machines. Hawking didn't have anything to do with either but it was just to illustrate a point.
Respect the hussle yawl
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2018 20:06:13 GMT -5
I agree with this. He has received 1,000x times the attention his peers have, many of which have done far more relevant and groundbreaking work... and the reason is because of his disability. Now I applaud him for pushing through and not using his diagnosis as a crutch to check out and do nothing with his life. I would argue that his passion for his work probably kept him alive and also hopefully provided inspiration for others with MS to not give up. However lets not pretend he was a once in a generation theorist who did anything to help the human race progress. The guy is credited with 9 specific theories that are integral to our understanding of black holes. Perhaps expanding our knowledge base of the universe beyond our world is not something you consider helpful to the human race, but...you're kinda simple if you don't grasp the importance of minds that figure these things out and yeah- he was very important because of the direction he specifically pushed thought within the scientific community. No idea what a "once in a generation theorist" would even be. Not a single one has existed alone at any time in history. And he had ALS, not MS. I get he was a smart guy who was capable of thinking outside the normal parameters humans are trapped in... but he got way more attention/praise/credit than someone who was not disabled would have gotten, plain and simple.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2018 7:16:26 GMT -5
In science, you can't ever "prove" a theory. You have evidence enough to accept the theory but you can't prove it. Evolution has an insurmountable amount of evidence so we accept it but it has never been "proven" because science must admit that we don't "know" anything. The laws of physics could change tomorrow so we don't say we've proved gravity. I get your point... I just don’t understand putting him on a hero type pedestal when all his work is on stuff that will likely never impact the human race. Do something that makes this world a better place and that’s worth celebrating... theorize for 60 years about something that can’t be validated and will never be a part of our existence...meh. You realize people said the same thing about Michael Faraday right? His response? "You'll care about these discoveries once you can tax them." Life wouldn't be nearly as good without Faraday's discoveries. Don't be so feeble minded bro.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2018 7:19:43 GMT -5
And "A Brief History of Time" is a REALLY good book for the lay person. Especially since it came out in the 80s when the only good layperson stuff was by Sagan.
First time I've been here in probably 3 months and this is the first thread I see. Reminded me of why I don't come here anymore. It's like you're all in this misery competition. I don't get it. Enjoy life and quit embracing all the negativity.
I know I know, the snowflake will exit stage left again. Peace bros.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2018 7:34:21 GMT -5
The guy is credited with 9 specific theories that are integral to our understanding of black holes. Perhaps expanding our knowledge base of the universe beyond our world is not something you consider helpful to the human race, but...you're kinda simple if you don't grasp the importance of minds that figure these things out and yeah- he was very important because of the direction he specifically pushed thought within the scientific community. No idea what a "once in a generation theorist" would even be. Not a single one has existed alone at any time in history. And he had ALS, not MS. I get he was a smart guy who was capable of thinking outside the normal parameters humans are trapped in... but he got way more attention/praise/credit than someone who was not disabled would have gotten, plain and simple. Perhaps that is because most people do not find his line of work interesting because it is so complicated? I'm not going to disagree that his disability certainly added to his notoriety, but I think it diminishes his actual accomplishments to say that he was only famous because of the disability.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2018 8:46:49 GMT -5
And "A Brief History of Time" is a REALLY good book for the lay person. Especially since it came out in the 80s when the only good layperson stuff was by Sagan. First time I've been here in probably 3 months and this is the first thread I see. Reminded me of why I don't come here anymore. It's like you're all in this misery competition. I don't get it. Enjoy life and quit embracing all the negativity. I know I know, the snowflake will exit stage left again. Peace bros. How is questioning why he is considered "great" a misery competition? Is this a board focused on quantum physics filled with people who should have all Hawking's accomplishments memorized? Or is it a group of (kinda) normal dudes who might not read Astronomy Today while taking a shit? I don't think this place is a misery competition, because I don't like to lose and that's a competition I would lose every day.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2018 9:02:40 GMT -5
And "A Brief History of Time" is a REALLY good book for the lay person. Especially since it came out in the 80s when the only good layperson stuff was by Sagan. First time I've been here in probably 3 months and this is the first thread I see. Reminded me of why I don't come here anymore. It's like you're all in this misery competition. I don't get it. Enjoy life and quit embracing all the negativity. I know I know, the snowflake will exit stage left again. Peace bros. Don’t be a baby... questioning things and debating issues is what adults do
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Post by PatSox on Mar 21, 2018 10:34:44 GMT -5
Just read that Hawking's remains will sit next to Newton's and Darwin's .........what a bunch of smart ashes
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Post by Angelo on Mar 21, 2018 16:20:49 GMT -5
And "A Brief History of Time" is a REALLY good book for the lay person. Especially since it came out in the 80s when the only good layperson stuff was by Sagan. First time I've been here in probably 3 months and this is the first thread I see. Reminded me of why I don't come here anymore. It's like you're all in this misery competition. I don't get it. Enjoy life and quit embracing all the negativity. I know I know, the snowflake will exit stage left again. Peace bros. Feynman was pretty damned good for laymen.
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Post by Comrade Question on Mar 21, 2018 17:20:33 GMT -5
Honest question: what qualifies any of you to determine the relative (pun intended) worth of a theoretical physicist to his field, especially one whose body of work comprises 50 years? Do any of you have anything resembling a post-secondary education in physics?
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Post by Angelo on Mar 21, 2018 17:58:42 GMT -5
Honest question: what qualifies any of you to determine the relative (pun intended) worth of a theoretical physicist to his field, especially one whose body of work comprises 50 years? Do any of you have anything resembling a post-secondary education in physics? You realize there are like 2 engineers on this forum? And Sporty got her BS in Chem with minors in Math and Physics and her Masters/PhD specialized in France's history in Chemistry and the Sciences in general. And it pretty easy to read up on physicists and what they contributed to the fields? There is this great thing called the internet that gives you access to a couple metric fuck tons of information pretty damned quickly nowadays. Hell Floyd's previous interest in the field probably gave him a better understanding of who contributed what historically than most people just getting their degree in it nowadays.
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